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TRANSCRIPT
OF ABC RADIO 774 INTERVIEW WITH DEREK GUILLE - Tuesday, July
6, 2004
Music: "P.S. I Love You" by the Beatles
Derek
P.S. I Love You. Sally McLean has written and directed a new
play called "PS I Love You". it focusses on the home
front in Melbourne during 1942, during World war Two. It particularly
focusses on women and women's roles in the auxiliary services
at the time. Sally good evening, welcome to the program.
Sally
Good evening Derek, lovely to be here.
Derek
I'm so pleased you could join us. I'm intrigued by ps I love
you. what's the background to this story? How did you come to
write it?
Sally
Well essentially, I guess, our family, as I discovered through
trawling through the old family history archives, have been very
military based, since probably the 1700's. But we actually discovered
that my Great uncle, Uncle Frank Dolphin was on Kododa, and sadly
lost on Kokoda. And so, I've read all his letters that he'd sent
home from the front, and his photo was always on display in my
grandparent's house. And my grandmother was very much still in
the mode of the depression and World War 2, where we still had
dripping in a container by the oven and that sort of thing.
Derek
Oh.
Sally
Ooo. Exactly!
Derek
No, no I'm remembering. It wasn't that long ago that we stopped
having dripping. I used to love toast and dripping for breakfast.
Sally
Oh well, yes, I suppose, yes that's true, but as a seven year
old, when you didn't have to have dripping, it was like "eew,
really?".
Derek
Eew, yuck, yes.
Sally
And you used to get told "well we had to have this all the
way through the second world war - don't you complain - we survived"!
But it was that influence of the family, and then there was a
friend of the family, Doris Carter, who has sadly passed away
now, but she was a Wing Officer in the WAAAF, and I actually
never knew about her war service, sadly, 'till after she died.
But she worked in intelligence as it turned out, so we understand,
and that got me really interested in women's roles in the War,
because I always had the impression women sat home knitting socks
and putting care packages together, and of course they didn't
- they did so much more and took on so much of an active role
in Australian society while the War was taking place, because
we needed so many of our men to fight. And so all the auxiliary
services, I discovered, were heavily populated by the female
population. They were all signing up and serving - in the WAAAF,
in the WRANS, in the Army, in the Land Army, which sadly wasn't
acknowledged as an actual armed service as such, but all the
girls volunteered to go out and work on the farms - keep all
the produce coming - and there were several other versions of
service, such as Cheer Up Girls, and all sorts of different roles
these women played.
Derek
What I find interesting about PS I Love You is the fact that
in the last decade or so we've actually heard more about the
Women's Land Army and the roles the women played there on farms
as you say and doing the work that men had previously done to
ensure that there was a supply of food, that production kept
turning over, but we haven't heard much, and there's not been
a particular focus women in the metropolitan area - women doing
jobs on the Home Front.
Sally
Exactly. I was amazed. I mean for the first time this year I
went to the ANZAC memorial service at the Shrine, on ANZAC Day
- the Dawn Service - which I'd always intended to go to and had
never managed to do. And I finally got there and it was meeting
a couple of women who had actually served in the Australian Women's
Army - I didn't even know we had an Army of women then! I didn't
even realise that women had been signing up for this auxiliary
service! And one of them had been a Gunner, which I was completely
amazing to me, because they were being trained to use artillery
and anti-aircraft guns -
Derek
Yes -
Sally
- from the tops of buildings, and on the coastline. And that
was a revelation to me because now we have this thing about women
not having active service, but then we were having them man these,
well, these weapons to protect Australia from invasion. And I
found that absolutey fascinating and got talking to her. And
I guess also that whole thing of finally being there, amongst
all these people who had served, who had come to remember those
who hadn't survived and hadn't come back, or those who had sadly
passed in the years gone by, it really brought it tangibly home
to me that Melbourne as a city had actually gone through a really
tough time itself through that War. I mean, essentially, we were
behaving - we had rations, we had the ration cards, we had sandbags
on all the major buildings, we had guns on the roofs, we had
Air Raid practice, we did all of that, and, of course, fortunately
we weren't bombed , but we were preparing as if we were going
to be. And the fear level at the time was exceptionally high,
so, we really were a nation that was preparing, for the first
time I think in Australia's history, in, you know, European history,
we were preparing to be invaded. And that's quite an amazing
thing to realise - that we weren't that remote, really, from
what was going on. It was only happening off the coast of Queensland
and up near Darwin. We were very close to being in trouble.
Derek
Well, that's right. We remember the various artillery placements
put around at the time of the Crimean, and things like that,
when we thought the Russians were coming, but it was never anywhere
near as near, either overtly or covertly, as the Japanese threat
to Australia was.
Sally
No, exactly. Because they were in Indonesia, they were so close
to us, and in New Guinea and they were all coming through all
these countries that were far too close for comfort. And I've
been reading intelligence reports from 1942 and you could see
that the people in control were a little nervous as well! I mean
they had all sorts of plans and contingencies on how to cope
with an invasion, should it come to that, and they fed the population
with a lot of propaganda, obviously, to keep them working and
to keep everyone working as a unit, so that we would be ready,
should it happen. And speaking to people who were there at the
time, they were saying it was a great party atmosphere, but it
was almost "Party - because tomorrow we may not be here".
Derek
Well thank goodness you've been gathering these stories before
they've all disappeared - that's the one thing - but how do you
take this very big canvas that we've just discussing and put
it on the stage? What's the focus of the play? How does it work?
Sally
Well I ended up ... ah ... because, as you say, there are a lot
of stories and I obviously haven't been able to incorporate every
single one, as much as I'd love to, so we brought it all down
to ten different characters - essentially two households. We
have one that's four girls living in a rooming house together
- one's in the WAAAF, one's in the WRANS, another works in the
Army and the fourth one isn't serving as such, but she's a Cheer
Up Girl - which are the girls who used to go out to all the dances
and be dance partners for all the soldiers on leave and sing
at various concerts and all that sort of thing. And they also
used to hand out cigarettes and talk to the soliders that had
come back injured. So she does that - that's her War service.
Then the other household is made up of a father and a daughter,
and the son is fighting on Kokoda and the father's sister is
a nurse who was serving in Singapore. And the nurse character
is actually in the play and she becomes a Prisoner of War. So,
we get her side of being a female in a Prisoner of War camp,
which I know has been done before, but I felt a need to address
the fact that women were on the War Front as well -
Derek
Yes -
Sally
- during that War. And we then have a RAAF pilot, who is based
in Plymouth, part of the 10th Squadron, who were initially shipped
out to pick up some new Sutherlands, "flying boats"
in mid-'39 I think it was - and they were there when War was
declared, so the Australian Government told them to stay there.
So we have one pilot who is out there with his squadron, who
hasn't come home yet - been out there for three years. And then,
I have a Guerka in the story as well, because I have a Nepalese
actor down here and I wrote the role for him because I think
the Guerka's aren't covered very much and we don't know much
about them and they did fight with the Australians on a lot of
the battlefields and battle arenas.
Derek
Well, that's right. Fought alongside with the British and Australian
Forces - that's correct. Sally, Judith has joined us. Judith,
you were in the Land Army, were you Judith?
Judith
Auxiliary.
Derek
Auxiliary Land Army?
Judith
Not the main one.
Derek
Yes
Judith
We worked 'round various properties. And we got a badge and a
pair of overalls.
Derek
And set to work.
Judith
That's right.
Derek
You were in Tasmania, Judith?
Judith
I was then, yes.
Derek
And you worked around, what, all of Tassie?
Judith
No, all round the properties in our area. And my father wouldn't
sign the papers for me to join the main Land Army, 'cause he
said "Oh, you'll be carting all those milk cartons on the
Northwest Coast." And I tell you what, I lifted sheep and
did all sorts of things. And we drove tractors and nobody will
accept us.
Derek
And I guess that's the point Sally's making, isn't it, that there
was all that service that was done, and it's not service that's
recognised in the same way that the other forms of service that
were necessary during the Wars has been recognised. And continues
to be recognised with the new Service medal that's been announced.
Judith
And we drove stock to saleyards. And cattle and sheep - for miles.
Derek
Judith, do you have fond memories of it?
Judith
Yes, I do. It was great. I was about 17, 18 then. And my father
wouldn't sign the papers for me to join the Land Army as such.
Derek
The full Land Army, yes.
Judith
Yes. But we don't get any recognition and we've been trying for
years.
Derek
And it's recognition that is so deserved, too. Judith thanks
for calling in. Sally, I'm glad Judith rang in, because you,
in fact, are still after people's stories and, well, all sorts
of aspects of women on the Home Front, aren't you?
Sally
Oh, absolutely. And regarding Judith and her Land Army work -
we do have a Land Army character as well, and I'm very aware
that those girls were not officially recognised and it's a great
shame they weren't. 'Cause the saying goes "An army marches
on it's stomach" - well, if these girls hadn't been producing
the produce, the country would have fallen apart!
Derek
That's right! Not only the army, but everybody.
Sally
Exactly! So, I think it is something long overdue. There have
been rumours that they are looking at acknowledging these girls
finally. I mean, I don't know for certain, but I sincerely hope
that's true, because they did an amazing amount of work, and
probably more than people realise. As Judith was saying - lugging
sheep around and driving trucks! It was hard manual labour and
they did an incredible job. But yes, I am looking for stories.
After writing the play, and it's set primarily in May of 1942,
that specific month, for many reasons, but mainly because we
had The Battle of the Coral Sea, which was the first time we
had a major land and, ah, air and sea battle occur near Australia
with the Japanese, but also the Brown Out Murders were going
on at the time.
Derek
Same time, that's right.
Sally
Which was the strangling of women in Melbourne in the Brown Outs.
Which sadly, turned out to be an American G.I. that was responsible.
So there's that whole thing of women who were out there being
independent, probably for the first time Australia's European
history, women were out there actually "doing their bit"
and were actually able to step outside the house - and all of
a sudden someone starts murdering them halfway through the War.
It put a great deal of extra fear on the Melbourne population
particularly. My Nana lived a block away from where the first
body was discovered and she said at the time she was terrified,
as all women were, as this was the first time in the history
of Australia that we had a serial killer. Which is what he was.
So no-one really understood the psychology of these acts either.
I guess what I'm looking for are stories from people who lived
through that time. Or people who's parents lived through it and
may have talked about it, who may have passed on the information.
Because we want to involve the community. It's something that
I personally wasn't aware of - how wartime affected Melbourne.
I hadn't ever really looked at it. And it's a fascinating piece
of history for this city that hasn't really been covered on stage.
And I would love to hear from those people who were there. Because
we want to do a big display in the foyer of the venue of all
these stories. And any images or photos people might be happy
for us to reproduce to put up there as well.
Derek
And with intentions of having a website and all those sorts of
things too.
Sally
Yes, we have a website for the play already and we're building
a seperate section, which, at this point, is tentatively called
- "The Way We Were" and it's about the people who were
there. And to have that then as an online testimonial and record
of these people's experiences. So that everyone, around the world,
if they wish, can actually tap in and have a look at it.
Derek
So, how do people actually get in touch with you - and I should
mention that the premier is the 31st of July -
Sally
Yes.
Derek
So how do people find out more about participating and contributing?
Sally
And getting tickets!
Derek
Yes, and getting tickets!
Sally
The best thing to do ... we've got our website which is www.salmac.com/loveyou/
and the other way to contact me is through the phone number 0410
798 514.
Derek
So that's www.salmac.com/loveyou or 0410 798 514. The Premier's
the 31st of July and what's the venue you're using?
Sally
We're using Mt Martha House in Mt Martha, which actually was
appropriated by the Army during the Second World War, and it
served as a RAAF base, and also as an R & R location for
the American soldiers, so it, itself, is tied up with the story
as well, which is a kind of nice piece of syncronicity.
Derek
Well, we'll keep in touch and we'll keep letting people know
that they can contribute to this play and the expansions of it
through the web and so forth. Thank you so much for being with
us tonight, Sally, I do appreciate it.
Sally
That's alright Derek - thank you!
Derek
Sally McLean, writer and director of "PS I Love You".
You'll be able to contact Sally through our web page as well
because Jeremy has been putting the links up as we speak. It's
seven to eight on 774 ABC Melbourne and ABC Victoria.
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